Gay Vet Picks Up the Pace
March 16, 2007
Check out this segment from Paula Zahn’s show featuring Iraq War vet and openly gay HRC spokesperson Eric Alva. The furor around General Pace’s statement calling homosexuality immoral continues unabated. Pace refuses to apologize for his moralistic judgement. He now has the backing of GOP presidential candidate Sam Brownback who wrote a letter President Bush in support of Pace.
Entry Filed under: Advocacy, Congress, LGBT, Politics, Sam Brownback, Video, War, YouTube. .
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1.
Webster | March 16, 2007 at 2:20 pm
“To penalise someone because of their sexual orientation is like what used to happen to us [in South Africa]; to be penalised for something which we could do nothing [about] — our ethnicity. I would find it quite unacceptable to condemn, persecute a minority that has already been persecuted.”
– Bishop Desmond Tutu
“I still hear people say that I should not be talking about the rights of lesbian and gay people and I should stick to the issue of racial justice. But I hasten to remind them that Martin Luther King Jr. said, ‘Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.’ I appeal to everyone who believes in Martin Luther King Jr.’s dream to make room at the table of brother- and sisterhood for lesbian and gay people.”
– Coretta Scott King
2.
bloggernista | March 16, 2007 at 2:44 pm
Webster, these quotes are awesome and so true.
3.
Brent | March 16, 2007 at 2:49 pm
I don’t agree with Pace, but I do say this:
Goodbye freedom of speech. Hello political correctness. Bye-bye America.
By the way, I’d bet my life that the majority of people in America agree with Pace, they just don’t have the balls to say it.
I have nothing against gay people. I think that they have the right to be who they are, without persecution. At the same time, I feel that those who have a problem with gay people, also have the right to be who they are, without persecution.
It’s really stupid to me that people on both sides have such a problem with something so meaningless.
Be who you are. Screw what other people think. Who cares?
4.
Your Uncle Bastard | March 16, 2007 at 3:18 pm
Brent – that is idiotic on its face. Replace the pejorative term ‘homosexual’ with Jew, black, Muslim, etc. etc. and you might begin to understand why it’s such an offensive comment.
PLUS, nothing about Pace’s job requires public moralizing about his supposedly “private” beliefs. Freedom of speech does not mean the unfettered right to say whatever you think whatever the cost. Pace spoke out in his position of authority, not as a private citizen, and that was WRONG – and had nothing to do with the again-pejorative term “political correctness”. It’s beyond the pale that Pace would support discharging linguists under DADT when it’s been well-repoted that our military is desperately short of translators that are fluent Arabic or Farsi. And all of this coming from someone who’s just fine granting MORAL WAIVERS to FELONS.
The hypocrisy is breathtaking!
Here’s a good rule of thumb, for you and for Pace: keep your opinions – especially those guaranteed to offend people with different, and perhaps more enlightened viewpoints – to yourself. Irrational prejudice against gays is one more thing we can “thank” the major religions for.
5.
Jody | March 16, 2007 at 3:59 pm
“Be who you are. Screw what other people think. Who cares?”
…because people like General Pace work diligently to treat gays like second class citizens. People like him want to criminalize those who want to ‘be who they are’, because they feel it is immoral.
Let me know if I’m going to fast for you.
“those who have a problem with gay people, also have the right to be who they are, without persecution.”
Well, aren’t they just the victim too, then. Poor little homophobes, innocently bashing gays. They’re martyrs! Martyrs I say!
“It’s really stupid to me that people on both sides have such a problem with something so meaningless.”
And judging from your post, you know all about stupid.
6.
Soundboy_Jeff | March 16, 2007 at 4:13 pm
It’s really stupid to me that people on both sides have such a problem with something so meaningless.
Be who you are. Screw what other people think. Who cares?
—
you care when your ’spouse’ has no health insurance, and you can’t cover him with yours because your company doesn’t offer insurance for domestic partners.
you care when the REPUBLICAN party brings up your relationship to use as a wedge issue and spur their base to vote (funny, the Dems NOR the GLBT caucus first brought up gay marriage… it was the REPUBLICANS).
you care when this devicive issue causes MORE people to think its okay to bash gays. either in print, or driving to the nearest gay ghetto and using a baseball bat/fists.
you care when you didn’t CHOOSE to be gay, but people CHOOSE to deny you civil rights that everyone else have BECAUSE you’re gay.
you care when 1500 rights that are given automatically to married couples are denied to you… because your government doesn’t acknowledge your relationship exists legally.
why does the other side care if I’m in love with another man?
how does my relationship affect them specifically?
is it all based on religion? what happened to the American ‘melting-pot’?
If heterosexual people can accept that gays were BORN gay… then there’s no argument that we’re victims of discrimination
overall… we’re Americans. Isn’t that enough to have the same rights as other people?
7.
lauram | March 16, 2007 at 6:03 pm
Hey Brent. Hello Political Correctness. Hello Better America.
Politically Correct me all you want to – doesn’t matter. I don’t mind being polite to my fellow citizens. Don’t know why politeness scares the shit out of you.
8.
George Grover | March 16, 2007 at 6:44 pm
I am a Straight man who has been involved with gay people most of my life because I have never shyed away from interactions with and being friends with THOSE PEOPLE. It is funny but absolutely every time I have continued a conversation and/or continued to pressure the person who was against GAY PEOPLE I have found that they are to put it simply HOMOPHOBES. I would even say that at least most of the people I have confronted, after a considerable time in discussion, determined them to be afraid that they might possibly be, I DARE SAY, CLOSET HOMOSEXUALS. bUT YOU PHOBES DON’T HAVE ANYTHING TO WORRY ABOUT BECAUSE it don’t rub off.
9. Top Posts « WordPress.com | March 16, 2007 at 6:58 pm
[...] Gay Vet Picks Up the Pace Check out this segment from Paula Zahn’s show featuring Iraq War vet and openly gay HRC spokesperson Eric Alva. […] [...]
10.
bloggernista | March 16, 2007 at 7:31 pm
Brent, stop being such a drama queen! What Pace said was wrong. No one is saying that he does not have the right to say it. We are saying that we think he is a bigot for saying.
11.
live n letlive | March 16, 2007 at 8:55 pm
I’m not gay and I personally don’t know anyone who is. Brent misses the whole point completely. Don’t ask, don’t tell is the policy of the military Pace is suposed to be in charge of. He can have all the private feelings he wants as Peter Pace, but he cannot voice them publicly as General Peter Pace. By his statement he has shown that he is not intelligent enough or qualified to hold the position he holds and should be replaced.
12.
Mikef | March 17, 2007 at 12:55 am
Pace’s freedom to speak like a bigot is the same as our freedom to call him a bigot.
Gay soldiers are the one’s who are being denied freedom of speech. That should be obvious to anyone paying attention
13.
lutz meyerding | March 17, 2007 at 1:25 am
he shud be allowed to say whatever he wants
i’m all in favour of free speech
i don’t like gays, jews, africans..and they dont like me either
see?long live free speech
14.
avoiceofreason | March 17, 2007 at 1:56 am
General Pace’s comments were out of order because he was speaking in his governmental capacity, and if he wanted to comment on homosexuals actively living their lifestyle within the military it should have been framed froma policy point of view.
In all probability, he may have done more for ending Don’t ask, Don’t tell by stating his private views, which of course he is entitled to, but which also had no place in the arena he was speaking from.
While Gen. Pace’s personal views about homosexuality is evident, as are his views about adultery, one has to question why the military typically pays little attention to adultery, even though many in the service do stray. I know, I served and saw what went on when units are deployed far from home. The reason is two fold; one the cases would backlog JAG for decades, and two, morality, within the framework of sexual practices has little relevance towards being a competent soldier, sailor, marine, or airman.
15.
FraudWasteAbuse | March 17, 2007 at 8:59 am
Why should the general apologize for having an opinion?
16.
FraudWasteAbuse | March 17, 2007 at 9:02 am
Pedophiles say the same thing.
I don’t care what gays do with each other, but you’ll never convince me that it’s normal.
17.
bloggernista | March 17, 2007 at 9:23 am
Fraud, General Pace is paid to focus on the military not to spew his personal opinions via the media. And comparing gay people to pedophiles is so old school. Can’t you homo haters come up with something better? BTW, you should know that research has found that most pedophiles are straight, white and male. Sound like anyone you know?
18.
tonyintinytown | March 17, 2007 at 9:34 am
poor peter, poor brent – time so fleeting and so wastefully spent. the good general’s commentary like this post is nothing but personal opinion. however, that he was in uniform when his comments were made gives the appearance of government sanctioned opinion. and while in truth it was useless and harmful rhetoric he has the right to state his views on morality. yet since the diatribe came while pace was fully decked in his military regalia, his employers – we the people have the right to demand he disengage and resign his post. one other observation on that portion of the pace interview, he spoke in very hushed tones, curiously muted tones. it made me wonder if the views were his own or those of another. which carries more risk, being the puppet or the puppeteer?
19.
Shane | March 17, 2007 at 11:18 am
If there are some who want to make such a big deal about gays in the military….fine….then when said homophobes are wounded in the heat of battle and there is only a gay man/woman to protect them…just leave them there…completely unprotected. If you want to play rough and act like children then let’s play rough.
20.
Brent | March 17, 2007 at 11:18 am
I never said it’s not offensive. I am offended. But he still has the right to say whatever he wants.
And folks if you read my post, I said that I do not agree with him. I have nothing against gay people. He should apologize to be polite, yes. But should the government force him too?
But honestly, who is truly free from prejudice, in one form or another? I don’t care if you are not honest with me. But you should be honest with yourself, and perhaps not throw stones in a glass house.
I just wish that people could learn to get along in this world, because we truly have more similarities than differences. We argue about the most idiotic things.
21.
Solo | March 17, 2007 at 12:02 pm
I am gay.
I am ex-military.
I served my country during the (1st) Gulf War (and resigned later with an ‘exemplary’ record.)
So I would be one of those souls whom General Pace thinks is immoral due to my private life…
*sigh*
Pot, kettle, black.
My life impacts on no-one but myself and my partner.
What is immoral is killing people.
His life impacts on families, communities and countries.
I wonder who, out of the two of us, will be more comfortable when we come to answer for our lives before God.
22.
Brent | March 17, 2007 at 1:15 pm
@Solo: First of all, thank you for your service, sir.
I must ask you, do you feel that it is immoral to kill in a war situation? If you had killed someone in a war, would you consider yourself to be an immoral person?
23.
FraudWasteAbuse | March 17, 2007 at 1:42 pm
Lack of rebuttal noted.
Not really sure how men molesting boys makes them straight.
24.
Solo | March 17, 2007 at 2:06 pm
Brent,
Firstly, it’s Ma’am
As to killing, what I will say is that after seeing what humans do to each other in the name of ‘war’, ‘justice’ etc, I resigned from the military and became a Buddhist.
I think taking a life in any situation is immoral. I just wish I’d known it; known life and myself better way back then :-/ but I was hell bent on trying to do the right thing for my family, my friends, my country (just from a ghastly point of ignorance.)
Perhaps even with time, as I grow in both age and hopefully wisdom, I may come to agree with General Pace but I suspect not for my guide now is “to help; never to harm” (not always a clear path) and in being gay, I harm none and I suspect in many ways judge others less harshly having known what it is to be judged so.
25.
Brent | March 17, 2007 at 3:58 pm
Sorry Ma’am. But anyway, is it immoral to kill someone in self-defense? If someone is shooting at you, is it wrong to kill him before he kills you?
If I walk in on someone raping my wife and daughter, am I considered immoral for killing him in defense of my family?
Isn’t it up to God to make these judgments?
There is a difference between killing and murder.
Should America not have a military at all, since it’s purpose is to fight wars, defend the nation, and kill enemies which would kill us if they could?
26.
Russ | March 17, 2007 at 4:18 pm
“Not really sure how men molesting boys makes them straight.”
Maybe you should ask the right wing of the Catholic church this question…they certainly did nothing to stop molestation by priests….
I am gay and have been with my partner for over sixteen years……and have never even considered molesting a child.(In fact would give my life to protect any child in trouble)..only a total moron would think homosexuality is to blame for that……..molestation is about power over someone…the same as rape. Ignorance never fails to amaze me..you see all these fancy commercials from the Marines to “be strong, be proud, etc. etc…” Oh, but please do not be honorable and tell us if you are gay…we couldn’t handle that…hypocrisy at it’s worst
27.
Brent | March 17, 2007 at 10:50 pm
Ah now I see. So it’s okay to say offensive things about Catholics, but not gays? Who would be free from hypocrisy? I’m Catholic, and you’ve offended me. You’d better apologize. Sound familiar?
28.
bloggernista | March 17, 2007 at 10:55 pm
Brent, Madonna was Catholic before she became a follower of Kaballah, and good knows we gays love her. There are also lots and lots of gay Catholics. There are so many gay Catholics that they have their own organization called Dignity.
29.
Brent | March 18, 2007 at 1:42 am
What does that have to do with anything? Madonna is not a real Catholic. There is a difference between saying you are Catholic, and actually being one.
You act as if this somehow makes it acceptable to say bad things about Catholics or something.
As a Catholic, some of the things that Madonna has done, I find very silly, but most celebrities are flamboyant in much the same way. It is nothing more than the craving for attention.
By the way, i was only kidding about being offended. There is very, very little which will actually offend me, especially when talking about words, because I do not allow others to make me upset this way. Not only am I far too intelligent for that, but I also do not care what other people think about me. This is probably what most separates you and me. You seem to get all bent out of shape about what someone else thinks of you and make it a much larger issue than it truly needs to be.
Just live your life dude, and stop worrying about what other people think about you. What the hell is so hard about that? Almost anyone can call themselves a victim of some sort of persecution, in one way or another, think about it. But why focus on it? Why must your life obsessively revolve around this?
As far as I’m concerned, it is none of my business what other people want to do with their lives, because it is not up to me to decide what others do, think, feel, and believe. It is not up to me to judge how other people behave. That is for God to sort out. I just try to live my life the best way that I can, and it is this focus which is one of the major keys to my success and happiness.
Don’t you see that you have become a prisoner of your own obsession about how others view you? Let it go. Say screw everyone else! Live your life for you. It’s time to set yourself free from these shackles. Do not demand acceptance from people who will never accept you. It is a waste of time. You can be far more happy by simply not concerning yourself with it. Just some friendly advice.
30. Pistas del Futuro » Heroe de Irak responde al General Pace | March 22, 2007 at 10:06 am
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